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References: <amv4t0+2spj@eGroups.com> <3D946545.6E2756A5@hsc.wvu.edu>
Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Re: "RR40" on eBay......
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 10:13:15 -0400
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Yeaaah...........!
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Stan Stephens=20
To: colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com=20
Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 10:03 AM
Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Re: "RR40" on eBay......
Reproduced from "The Gentleman's Magazine" Vol. 54 (1784)=20
"Corrections: p. 151 - 'the two English pennies of Richard I. prove to be=
spurious...=20
These pennies are thought to be the fabrications of a certain collector,=
notorious in this way, and who must suppose that to embarrass the path of =
any science with forgery and futility Implies no Infamy...=20
'=20
The crime is certainly greater than that which leads the common coiner to=
the gallows, inasmuch as it Is committed with more ease, and the profit is=
incomparably larger. The person above hinted at may therefore rest assured=
that, when his death shall have rendered the mention of his name safe and =
free from cruelty, not all his good qualities will prevent its being delive=
red to posterity with perpetual contempt and obloquy'; 4 pp. 521-23 and n.=
=20
4) This forecast referring to the reputation of John White of Newgate-Str=
eet, proved accurate, as he Is generally referred to today as 'notorious' f=
or his forgeries. See 1756, 64 n."=20
"It's the same old story, same old song and dance,.... my friend"=20
Areosmith=20
Stan=20
=20=20=20=20
njcopperjohn wrote:=20
When I started to post the comments on Sunday I was not very clear=20
(obviously) on what Bill meant by "AS IS" in his original description=20
on the coin that he asked me to post word by word (his exact words)=20
this coming Sunday. Usually he gives me the freedom to change around=20
wording as I see fit. Not in this case. He feels since the coin was=20
already sold by a major auction house in 1988, since the RR40 has=20
been written about in the Forgotten book, since he feels this is a=20
$45,000 today, since he feels that at $9,750 someone "in the know" is=20
a getting a steal - its being offered "AS IS" with a no return policy.=
=20
What else can I say. The buyer has to ask himself "Would Bill Anton=20
offer a $9,750 coin for sale if he felt it was not genuine?=20
Some people really appreciate some of the coins Bill owns. Some are=20
jealous. Some are envious. Some do not care. Some ...=20
Come Sunday Bill is saying you are getting a coin for possibly $9,750=20
that brought $16,000 in 1988. It was returned by the buyer after six=20
weeks as a forgery in 1988. We beg to differ. Its an experiment. Will=20
the new era of knowledge prevail or since it was a forgery in 1988 it=20
is still a forgery in 2002. Would Bill intentionally and publically=20
offer a forgery on E-Bay through me to purposely rip-off a fellow C-=20
4'er???=20
It does not get any better than this Ray! Its only a hobby and this=20
is just entertainment.=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
--- In colonial-coins@y..., Ray Williams <njraywms@o...> wrote:=20
> Hi John!=20
> I've been having a good laugh this AM at the opening posts.=20
These guys=20
> have a sense of humor. Seriously John, by removing the guarantee=20
from the=20
> coin, I feel that it shows a lack of confidence in this coin by=20
both you and=20
> Bill. Even if there has been an interest by serious collectors=20
privately,=20
> why would that be a reason to change your mind about the=20
guarantee? Also, I=20
> agree with Mike H that the gaurantee to begin with seemed=20
impossible to=20
> collect on... If it was proved that the coin was counterfeit, it=20
would be=20
> next to impossible to prove that it is a recent fabrication. You=20
do tend to=20
> gravitate toward controversial coins John. This Ryder 40 sure has=20
livened=20
> up the conversation on this group... for a while I was wondering if=20
my=20
> computer was receiving any posts.=20
>=20
> Ray W=20
>=20
>=20
> ----- Original Message -----=20
> From: "John Lorenzo" <johnmenc@o...>=20
> To: <colonial-coins@y...>=20
> Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 7:19 AM=20
> Subject: [Colonial Numismatics] Re: "RR40" on eBay......=20
>=20
>=20
> > I will ask Bill and post soon. JPL.=20
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > --- In colonial-coins@y..., ershye@a... wrote:=20
> > > Hi John. You have yet to answer Eric's question about which=20
> > university holds=20
> > > an example of the "Ryder-40". By chance it wouldn't be=20
McDonald's=20
> > Hamburger=20
> > > University where it is on display for their students to see what=
=20
> > the precise=20
> > > size of a pickle slice should be? <g>=20
> > >=20
> > > Ed=20
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:=20
> > colonial-coins-unsubscribe@e...=20
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to=20
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/=20
> >=20
> >=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:=20
colonial-coins-unsubscribe@egroups.com=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>Yeaaah...........!</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LE=
FT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>Fro=
m:</B>=20
<A title=3Dsstephens@hsc.wvu.edu href=3D"mailto:sstephens@hsc.wvu.edu">St=
an=20
Stephens</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
title=3Dcolonial-coins@yahoogroups.com=20
href=3D"mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com">colonial-coins@yahoogroups=
.com</A>=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, September 27, 2002 1=
0:03=20
AM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Colonial Numismatics=
] Re:=20
"RR40" on eBay......</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Reproduced from "The Gentleman's Magazine" Vol. 54 (1784)=
=20
<P>"Corrections: p. 151 - 'the two English pennies of Richard I. prove to=
be=20
spurious...=20
<P> These pennies are thought to be the fabrications of a certain=20
collector, notorious in this way, and who must suppose that to embarrass =
the=20
path of any science with forgery and futility Implies no Infamy... <BR>'=
=20
<BR>The crime is certainly greater than that which leads the common coine=
r to=20
the gallows, inasmuch as it Is committed with more ease, and the profit i=
s=20
incomparably larger. The person above hinted at may therefore rest assure=
d=20
that, when his death shall have rendered the mention of his name safe and=
free=20
from cruelty, not all his good qualities will prevent its being delivered=
to=20
posterity with perpetual contempt and obloquy'; 4 pp. 521-23 and n.=20
<P>4) This forecast referring to the reputation of John White of=20
Newgate-Street, proved accurate, as he Is generally referred to today as=
=20
'notorious' for his forgeries. See 1756, 64 n."=20
<P>"It's the same old story, same old song and dance,.... my friend"=20
<BR>Areosmith=20
<P>Stan <BR> =20
<P>njcopperjohn wrote:=20
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3D"CITE"> <TT>When I started to post the comments o=
n=20
Sunday I was not very clear</TT> <BR><TT>(obviously) on what Bill meant=
by=20
"AS IS" in his original description</TT> <BR><TT>on the coin that he as=
ked=20
me to post word by word (his exact words)</TT> <BR><TT>this coming Sund=
ay.=20
Usually he gives me the freedom to change around</TT> <BR><TT>wording a=
s I=20
see fit. Not in this case. He feels since the coin was</TT> <BR><TT>alr=
eady=20
sold by a major auction house in 1988, since the RR40 has</TT> <BR><TT>=
been=20
written about in the Forgotten book, since he feels this is a</TT>=20
<BR><TT>$45,000 today, since he feels that at $9,750 someone "in the kn=
ow"=20
is</TT> <BR><TT>a getting a steal - its being offered "AS IS" with a no=
=20
return policy.</TT> <BR><TT>What else can I say. The buyer has to ask=20
himself "Would Bill Anton</TT> <BR><TT>offer a $9,750 coin for sale if =
he=20
felt it was not genuine?</TT> <BR><TT>Some people really appreciate som=
e of=20
the coins Bill owns. Some are</TT> <BR><TT>jealous. Some are envious. S=
ome=20
do not care. Some ...</TT> <BR><TT>Come Sunday Bill is saying you are=20
getting a coin for possibly $9,750</TT> <BR><TT>that brought $16,000 in=
=20
1988. It was returned by the buyer after six</TT> <BR><TT>weeks as a fo=
rgery=20
in 1988. We beg to differ. Its an experiment. Will</TT> <BR><TT>the new=
era=20
of knowledge prevail or since it was a forgery in 1988 it</TT> <BR><TT>=
is=20
still a forgery in 2002. Would Bill intentionally and publically</TT>=20
<BR><TT>offer a forgery on E-Bay through me to purposely rip-off a fell=
ow=20
C-</TT> <BR><TT>4'er???</TT> <BR><TT>It does not get any better than th=
is=20
Ray! Its only a hobby and this</TT> <BR><TT>is just entertainment.</TT>=
=20
<BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> =20
<P><TT>--- In colonial-coins@y..., Ray Williams <njraywms@o...>=20
wrote:</TT> <BR><TT>> Hi John!</TT> <BR><TT>> &n=
bsp;=20
I've been having a good laugh this AM at the opening posts.</TT>=20
<BR><TT>These guys</TT> <BR><TT>> have a sense of humor. Serio=
usly=20
John, by removing the guarantee</TT> <BR><TT>from the</TT> <BR><TT>>=
=20
coin, I feel that it shows a lack of confidence in this coin by</TT>=20
<BR><TT>both you and</TT> <BR><TT>> Bill. Even if there has be=
en an=20
interest by serious collectors</TT> <BR><TT>privately,</TT> <BR><TT>>=
; why=20
would that be a reason to change your mind about the</TT>=20
<BR><TT>guarantee? Also, I</TT> <BR><TT>> agree with Mike H th=
at=20
the gaurantee to begin with seemed</TT> <BR><TT>impossible to</TT>=20
<BR><TT>> collect on... If it was proved that the coin was=20
counterfeit, it</TT> <BR><TT>would be</TT> <BR><TT>> next to impossi=
ble=20
to prove that it is a recent fabrication. You</TT> <BR><TT>do ten=
d=20
to</TT> <BR><TT>> gravitate toward controversial coins John. T=
his=20
Ryder 40 sure has</TT> <BR><TT>livened</TT> <BR><TT>> up the convers=
ation=20
on this group... for a while I was wondering if</TT> <BR><TT>my</TT>=20
<BR><TT>> computer was receiving any posts.</TT> <BR><TT>></TT>=20
<BR><TT>> Ray W</TT> <BR><TT>></TT> <BR><TT>></TT> <BR><TT>>=
;=20
----- Original Message -----</TT> <BR><TT>> From: "John Lorenzo"=20
<johnmenc@o...></TT> <BR><TT>> To: <colonial-coins@y...>=
</TT>=20
<BR><TT>> Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 7:19 AM</TT> <BR><TT>&g=
t;=20
Subject: [Colonial Numismatics] Re: "RR40" on eBay......</TT>=20
<BR><TT>></TT> <BR><TT>></TT> <BR><TT>> > I will ask Bill a=
nd=20
post soon. JPL.</TT> <BR><TT>> ></TT> <BR><TT>> ></TT>=20
<BR><TT>> ></TT> <BR><TT>> > --- In colonial-coins@y...,=20
ershye@a... wrote:</TT> <BR><TT>> > > Hi John. You have yet to=
=20
answer Eric's question about which</TT> <BR><TT>> > university=20
holds</TT> <BR><TT>> > > an example of the "Ryder-40". By chan=
ce it=20
wouldn't be</TT> <BR><TT>McDonald's</TT> <BR><TT>> > Hamburger</T=
T>=20
<BR><TT>> > > University where it is on display for their stud=
ents=20
to see what</TT> <BR><TT>> > the precise</TT> <BR><TT>> > &=
gt;=20
size of a pickle slice should be? <g></TT> <BR><TT>> > >=
</TT>=20
<BR><TT>> > > Ed</TT> <BR><TT>> ></TT> <BR><TT>> >=
</TT>=20
<BR><TT>> ></TT> <BR><TT>> > To unsubscribe from this group=
,=20
send an email to:</TT> <BR><TT>> >=20
colonial-coins-unsubscribe@e...</TT> <BR><TT>> ></TT> <BR><TT>>=
;=20
></TT> <BR><TT>> ></TT> <BR><TT>> > Your use of Yahoo! G=
roups=20
is subject to</TT> <BR><TT><A=20
href=3D"http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/">http://docs.yahoo.com/info/t=
erms/</A></TT>=20
<BR><TT>> ></TT> <BR><TT>> ></TT> <BR> =20
<P><BR><TT>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:</TT>=20
<BR><TT>colonial-coins-unsubscribe@egroups.com</TT> <BR> <BR>&nbs=
p;=20
<P><TT>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the <A=20
href=3D"http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/">Yahoo! Terms of=20
Service</A>.</TT></P></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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