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- From mantoloking2002@yahoo.com Wed Oct 23 08:48:42 2002
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Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 15:48:33 -0000
To: colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: Willow/NE Shilling is Phony
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Mike,
Pretty deceptive counterfeit. Seeing the Willow, I can now see it
more on the reverse than the obverse of the overstruck piece. Do you
have a sense of about when it was struck as the published piece seems
clearly made to deceive. A copy for representation purposes of a NE
or Willow Tree piece is one thing....but a unique overstrike.
THANKS for the quick heads up.
Roger S.
--- In colonial-coins@y..., mike hodder <mhodder@t...> wrote:
> The Willow Tree Shilling struck over a New England Shilling that I
> published recently is fake. About a week ago, I saw an obviously
> counterfeit Willow Tree shilling that was struck from the same
> dies as seen on the overstrike. If the Willow is fake the
> overstrike has to be fake, too, and I'm guessing the New England
> shilling undertype is fake, as well.
>
> I've uploaded jpg illustrations of the fake Willow Tree Shilling
> and the fake Willow/NE overstrike. If you compare the two, you'll
> see they were struck from the same false Willow dies.What the
> illustrations won't show is that the Willow coin is evenly thick
> everywhere , shows no signs of the S-bend from having been
> struck on a rocker press, and the edge shows it was made from
> modern, machine rolled strip.
>
> By themselves, the Willow Tree Shilling dies are not really
> deceptive. The shilling I saw last week is on a non-deceptive
> flan, too, being too round, too evenly thick, and it has a
> rounded edge. I'm assuming the NE punches would also be
> non-decepetive and an NE flan made by this counterfeiter would
> also not be confused with the genuine. I don't think
> sophisticated collectors would be fooled by these fake dies.
> Beginners might, and I would not be surprised to see one or more
> of these in non-specialist dealers cases at shows.
>
> More deceptive is the overstrike. It fooled me and some others.
> The flan was bent the way one would expect it to be, the edge
> raised no concerns, and the way the Willow and NE designs were
> blurred by the overstriking made them appear correct. The weight
> was high, especially for a holed coin, but not outside the range
> of observed weights for Massachusetts shillings.
>
> The counterfeiter appears to be clever and experienced with
> Massachusetts silver coins. His Willow/NE overstrike was designed
> to fit into the known typological sequence and to represent a
> coin whose existence might not be unexpected. He also realized
> thatmaking such an overstrike gave him a unique coin which, if it
> were accepted as genuine, would be very valuable.
>
> I owe collectors an apology for my mistake, particularly Lou
> Jordan and the other staff of the Colonial Newsletter, who
> published the coin as genuine.
>
>
> Mike Hodder
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