Halfpence circulation.

Contenido del artículo

From taxi_steve929@yahoo.com Mon Jan 23 12:24:42 2006
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From: Steve Frank <taxi_steve929@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Re: Halfpence circulation.
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Like putting a thin layer of gold on a no cents V nickel?<s>

Byron Weston <bkweston@verizon.net> wrote: Hi Bill, et al.
I believe current US law states something to the effect that
defacement of US coins must be something done in such a manner that
it adds value to the coin above its face value. I had looked up the
statute but probably would not have worried too about it, regardless,
when I sold some cut-out coin jewelry for a friend.
Byron

--- In colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com, William Triest <wtriest2@y...>
wrote:
>
> Yes, I thought so.
>
> I do wonder though if the law would apply to
> elongations, enamelling, love tokens etc, or would it
> have been enforced selectively.
>
> But, I don't expect to gain much through blackmail,
> however. Not even a defaced coin.
>
> Bill
> --- Steve Frank <taxi_steve929@y...> wrote:
>
> > That was more tongue in cheek Bill.<s>.....how about
> > elongated pennies? (cents for the purists)<s>
> >
> > William Triest <wtriest2@y...> wrote: What is
> > Jim defacing? The UK has periodically
> > demonitized old coinage, and the old shillings and
> > pence (pre decimal era) are in that category now.
> > Otherwise, the whole mailgroup has a blackmail
> > opportunity. Free sampl;es for all!
> >
> > Yes, I was indeed referring to countermarking
> > counterfeits.
> >
> > I wonder how the law mentioned by Steve would apply
> > to
> > "love tokens" and the enameled coins that the late
> > Victorians produced.
> >
> > Bill Triest
> >
> > --- Steve Frank <taxi_steve929@y...> wrote:
> >
> > > David, I read the question "To put advertising on
> > > counterfeits"....not the regal pieces. I wonder if
> > > that law is still on the books...if it is, Jim
> > > Skalbe is in a heap of trouble.<s>
> > >
> > > "palmers4@e..." <palmers4@e...> wrote:
> > I
> > > forget when it happened, but Great Britain passed
> > > legislation making it a
> > > crime to counterstamp "coin of the realm". I
> > believe
> > > it was later in the
> > > 19th century, which is why all the PEAR'S SOAP C/S
> > > are on French coins.
> > > But in answer to your question, MAYBE.
> > > We see them as advertising "tokens" now, I have no
> > > context as to what they
> > > were considered then. I would think they were
> > viewed
> > > by authoirities as
> > > damaged and debased coins, so I would think they
> > had
> > > no problem with people
> > > damaging already debased coinage? David
> > >
> > > Original Message:
> > > -----------------
> > > From: William Triest wtriest2@y...
> > > Date: Sun, 22 Jan 2006 11:03:35 -0800 (PST)
> > > To: colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Re: Halfpence
> > > circulation.
> > >
> > >
> > > <html><body>
> > >
> > >
> > > <tt>
> > > As an exercise in legalistic semantics: 
> > > If counterfeits had become illegal, but
> > merchant 
> > > tokens were still permitted, would putting
> > > advertising 
> > > on a counterfeit convert it to a quasi-legal
> > > merchant 
> > > token? 
> > > 
> > > Just a thought. 
> > > 
> > > Bill Triest 
> > > 
> > > --- Byron Weston <bkweston@v...> wrote: 
> > > 
> > > > I think this is the first time that you've
> > > agreed 
> > > > with me to such an 
> > > > extent, John. I think I'll mark my calendar! 
> > > > Byron 
> > > > 
> > > > --- In colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com, "John 
> > > > Lorenzo" <johnmenc@o...> 
> > > > wrote: 
> > > > > 
> > > > > Agreed - it seems so - I still like Mike
> > > Ringo's 
> > > > analogy - they 
> > > > > became so worthless and fround upon that the
> > > only 
> > > > real worth within 
> > > > > England may have been nothing more than base
> > > metal 
> > > > pieces which had 
> > > > > very limited value and ONE purpose would have
> > > been 
> > > > as possibly 
> > > > > advertising cards such as this piece. I guess
> > > it 
> > > > was one thing to 
> > > > > try to use them as money - but in terms of the
> > > law 
> > > > -it did not seem 
> > > > > a problem to put your OWN SIGNATURE on the 
> > > > counterfeits to 
> > > > advertise 
> > > > > your business without worrying about the
> > > POLICE 
> > > > coming in with a 
> > > > > warrant. If one was stuck with a hoard ... 
> > > > exportation to the 
> > > > > colonies of course seems logigal ... don't
> > > expect 
> > > > this piece going 
> > > > > on E-Bay anytime soon ... when I did buy
> > > this 
> > > > piece I did ask the 
> > > > > main question: Why would someone advertise
> > > his 
> > > > business on such a 
> > > > > piece or self incriminate himself using such
> > > a 
> > > > host coin? I guess 
> > > > > its more about quantity and for what purpose
> > > the 
> > > > CC's were being 
> > > > > used in the English economy during their
> > > RAPID 
> > > > decline in the very 
> > > > > early 19th century ... 
> > > > > 
> > > > > --- In colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com,
> > > "Byron 
> > > > Weston" 
> > > > > <bkweston@v...> wrote: 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > --- In colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com,
> > > "John 
> > > > Lorenzo" 
> > > > > <johnmenc@o...> 
> > > > > > wrote: 
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > It's hard to deny ... every couple of
> > > years 
> > > > someone tells me to 
> > > > > look 
> > > > > > > in Peck for this or that as an
> > alternate 
> > > > source of 
> > > > > information ... I 
> > > > > > > am overdue ... maybe this counterstamp
> > > piece 
> > > > is the trigger ... 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > By the time your counterstamp may have
> > > been 
> > > > counterstamped 
> > > > (>1810) 
> > > > > it 
> > > > > > is doubtful that counterfeit halfpence
> > > were 
> > > > still in general 
> > > > > > circulation, John, as apparently most
> > were 
> > > > melted by then, as 
> > > > well 
> > > > > as 
> > > > > > many of Boulton's earlier Cartwheel coinage
> > > of 
> > > > Pence and Twopence. 
> > > > > > Byron 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > >
> >
> __________________________________________________ 
> > > Do You Yahoo!? 
> > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
> > > protection around 
> > > <a
> > >
> >
> href="http://mail.yahoo.com">http://mail.yahoo.com</a>
> > > 
> > > </tt>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > 
> > >
> > > 
> > > <div style="width:500px; text-align:right;
> > > margin-bottom:1px;
> > > color:#909090;">
> > > <tt>SPONSORED LINKS</tt>
> > > </div>
> >
> === message truncated ===
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>

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<DIV id=RTEContent>Like putting a thin layer of gold on a no cents V nickel?<s> Byron Weston <bkweston@verizon.net> wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid"><TT>Hi Bill, et al. I believe current US law states something to the effect that defacement of US coins must be something done in such a manner that it adds value to the coin above its face value. I had looked up the statute but probably would not have worried too about it, regardless, when I sold some cut-out coin jewelry for a friend. Byron --- In colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com, William Triest <wtriest2@y...> wrote: > > Yes, I thought so. > > I do wonder though if the law would apply to > elongations, enamelling, love tokens etc, or would it > have been enforced selectively. > > But, I don't expect to gain much through
blackmail, > however. Not even a defaced coin. > > Bill > --- Steve Frank <taxi_steve929@y...> wrote: > > > That was more tongue in cheek Bill.<s>.....how about > > elongated pennies? (cents for the purists)<s> > > > > William Triest <wtriest2@y...> wrote: What is > > Jim defacing? The UK has periodically > > demonitized old coinage, and the old shillings and > > pence (pre decimal era) are in that category now. > > Otherwise, the whole mailgroup has a blackmail > > opportunity. Free sampl;es for all! > > > > Yes, I was indeed referring to countermarking > > counterfeits. > > > > I wonder how the law mentioned by Steve would apply > > to > > "love tokens" and the enameled coins that the late > > Victorians produced. > > > > Bill
Triest > > > > --- Steve Frank <taxi_steve929@y...> wrote: > > > > > David, I read the question "To put advertising on > > > counterfeits"....not the regal pieces. I wonder if > > > that law is still on the books...if it is, Jim > > > Skalbe is in a heap of trouble.<s> > > > > > > "palmers4@e..." <palmers4@e...> wrote: > > I > > > forget when it happened, but Great Britain passed > > > legislation making it a > > > crime to counterstamp "coin of the realm". I > > believe > > > it was later in the > > > 19th century, which is why all the PEAR'S SOAP C/S > > > are on French coins. > > > But in answer to your question, MAYBE. > > > We see them as advertising "tokens" now, I have no > > > context as to what they > > > were
considered then. I would think they were > > viewed > > > by authoirities as > > > damaged and debased coins, so I would think they > > had > > > no problem with people > > > damaging already debased coinage? David > > > > > > Original Message: > > > ----------------- > > > From: William Triest wtriest2@y... > > > Date: Sun, 22 Jan 2006 11:03:35 -0800 (PST) > > > To: colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Re: Halfpence > > > circulation. > > > > > > > > > <html><body> > > > > > > > > > <tt> > > > As an exercise in legalistic semantics: > > > If counterfeits had become illegal, but > > merchant > > > tokens were still permitted,
would putting > > > advertising > > > on a counterfeit convert it to a quasi-legal > > > merchant > > > token? > > > > > > Just a thought. > > > > > > Bill Triest > > > > > > --- Byron Weston <bkweston@v...> wrote: > > > > > > > I think this is the first time that you've > > > agreed > > > > with me to such an > > > > extent, John. I think I'll mark my calendar! > > > > Byron > > > > > > > > --- In colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com, "John > > > > Lorenzo" <johnmenc@o...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > >
> > > > Agreed - it seems so - I still like Mike > > > Ringo's > > > > analogy - they > > > > > became so worthless and fround upon that the > > > only > > > > real worth within > > > > > England may have been nothing more than base > > > metal > > > > pieces which had > > > > > very limited value and ONE purpose would have > > > been > > > > as possibly > > > > > advertising cards such as this piece. I guess > > > it > > > > was one thing to > > > > > try to use them as money - but in terms of the > > > law > > > > -it did not seem > > > > > a problem to put your OWN SIGNATURE on
the > > > > counterfeits to > > > > advertise > > > > > your business without worrying about the > > > POLICE > > > > coming in with a > > > > > warrant. If one was stuck with a hoard ... > > > > exportation to the > > > > > colonies of course seems logigal ... don't > > > expect > > > > this piece going > > > > > on E-Bay anytime soon ... when I did buy > > > this > > > > piece I did ask the > > > > > main question: Why would someone advertise > > > his > > > > business on such a > > > > > piece or self incriminate himself using such > > > a > > > > host
coin? I guess > > > > > its more about quantity and for what purpose > > > the > > > > CC's were being > > > > > used in the English economy during their > > > RAPID > > > > decline in the very > > > > > early 19th century ... > > > > > > > > > > --- In colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com, > > > "Byron > > > > Weston" > > > > > <bkweston@v...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com, > > > "John > > > > Lorenzo" > > > > > <johnmenc@o...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > It's hard to deny ... every couple of > > > years > > > > someone tells me to > > > > > look > > > > > > > in Peck for this or that as an > > alternate > > > > source of > > > > > information ... I > > > > > > > am overdue ... maybe this counterstamp > > > piece > > > > is the trigger ... > > > > > > > > > > > > By the time your counterstamp may have > > > been > > > > counterstamped > > > > (>1810) > > > > > it > > > > > > is doubtful that counterfeit halfpence > > > were > > >
> still in general > > > > > > circulation, John, as apparently most > > were > > > > melted by then, as > > > > well > > > > > as > > > > > > many of Boulton's earlier Cartwheel coinage > > > of > > > > Pence and Twopence. > > > > > > Byron > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best
spam > > > protection around > > > <a > > > > > > href="<A href="http://mail.yahoo.com/">http://mail.yahoo.com</A>"><A href="http://mail.yahoo.com/">http://mail.yahoo.com</A></a> > > > > > > </tt> > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > <div style="width:500px; text-align:right; > > > margin-bottom:1px; > > > color:#909090;"> > > > <tt>SPONSORED LINKS</tt> > > > </div> > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the
best spam protection around > <A href="http://mail.yahoo.com/">http://mail.yahoo.com</A> > </TT></BLOCKQUOTE> </DIV>
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URL de origen

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/colonial-coins/info

Fecha de publicación

2006-01-23

Volumen

Halfpence circulation. Público Deposited

[Colonial Numismatics] Re

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Relaciones

Autor NNP