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From: JCSpilman/iMAC <CNLF@Comcast.net>
Reply-To: JCSpilman1@Comcast.net
Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] wound down
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Ray -- et al
<p>Here is a snippet from the FORD/Kolbe catalog describing the NJ ms.
that I was discussing. See attachment.
<p>Jim/CNLF
<p>================================
<p>James Spilman wrote:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE> Ray -- There was one "Breen NJ Manuscript"
sold in the Ford/Kolbe sale and I have no idea� who purchased it.� �This
was the one that upset Hodder so much� when I wrote to GK and suggested
that this was the ms.� that� JJF� "stole"� (Breen's words) from Breen.�
There is a long story there!� �A similar comment from Breen appears
in an early CNL.� This may� have been a later edition from the one that
C4 reproduced.� I do not know.� Someday we may be able to locate it and
determine what he (Breen) actually wrote.� Those "sealed" Breen letters
(stored by Frank at ANS) to the late Ray Williamson of Lynchberg VA may
offer more clues. It is just another document for which to keep one's
eyes open!� I know that Breen made many trips to Princeton to search the
archives. GK does not tell folk who purchases what from him --� a
practice with which I fully agree -- so I have never bothered to ask him.�
George may see this comment and advise us! Jim/CNLF ============================================ On
Oct 13, 2006, at 3:29 PM, Ray Williams wrote:
<blockquote type="cite"><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>Hi Jim,</font></font><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>���
I wonder why Walter Breen considered the 58-n a questionable variety...�
I wish he would have written something about it.� Also, it would be awesome
to find something in the NJ State archives that would show that the State
had actually made Walter Mould remove his initials from the dies.� To this
point, the removal was thought to have been required by the state, why
else remove them.� It would be nice to have proof.� It is known who owns
Breen's unpublished manuscript (the original) and maybe it might have info
that is not in any of the copies that exist in the hobby.� Maybe�I can
pursue this further.</font></font><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>Ray</font></font>��
<blockquote style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----</div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><b>From:</b>
<a href="mailto:CNLF@Comcast.net" title="CNLF@Comcast.net">JCSpilman/iMAC</a></div>
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com" title="colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com">colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com</a></div>
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>Sent:</b> Friday, October 13, 2006 2:03
PM</div>
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Colonial Numismatics]
wound down</div>
<div id="ygrp-text">Ray - et al
<p>I recall a telephone discussion that I had with Walter Breen pre-1970
regarding the N.J. issues in general.
<p>His opinion at that time was that 56-n, 57-n and 58-n (which he considered
a questionable variety) were all obviously from the same hand and from
the same mint (he named "X" at that time) and was a mint that had no source
of planchet stock, so it used anything it could obtain.� They did not have
knowledge of annealing so <b>all</b> their strikes were made on work hardened
planchets, only a few of which resulted in a nice strike without signs
of the undertype.
<p>He also mentioned the existence of the WM specimens which the NJ legislature�
had ordered (the WM initials) removed from the specimens.
<p>All of this is documented -- he told me --� in "my NJ manuscript which
I can send you as soon as it returns from JJF".� He never received the
ms. back from JJF and this data is NOT recorded in any of the extant "Breen
NJ unpublished manuscripts"� that I know about.� It may still be floating
around out there, unrecognized as different (later edition) from the others.
<p>This trivia must remain as undocumented trivia until the ms. that Walter
had in mind puts in an appearance, someday.
<p>Jim/CNLF
<p>============<wbr>=========</wbr><wbr>===
<br>�
<br>� </wbr>
<p>Byron Weston wrote:
<blockquote type="CITE">--- In colonial-coins@<wbr>yahoogroups.</wbr><wbr>com,
Ray Williams <njraywms@...</wbr><wbr>>
<br>wrote:
<br>>
<br>> Hi Byron,
<br>>���� Nice coin!� I greatly enjoy the Camel Head NJ's for their
<br>abundance of different undertypes.� There is disagreement between me
<br>and some fellow NJ collectors as to where the Camel Heads were struck
<br>and by who (whom?).� I'll keep an open mind and hope that someday some
<br>proof unearths itself.� In all the years of writing the NJ Census in
<br>Penny Wise, the issue that I worked on the Camel Heads was the most
fun
<br>by far!!!� There was one person that only owned Camel heads (no other
<br>variety) and had 30 of them, if I remember right.� But nice find and
I
<br>hope to see it in the coper the next time we meet.
<br>> Ray
<br>>
<br>Thanks, Ray, I'll try to remember to bring it along the next time I
<br>know we'll be meeting.
<br>The only other Camel Head I've handled was a 57-n I attributed for
one
<br>of my dealer friends who consigned it to a C4 auction several years
<br>ago - unfortunately it was struck over one of them CT coppers, darn!
<br><s>
<br>I did have a "date set" of NJs years ago but currently have only one
<br>other NJ. I bought this one more for the undertype than as a Camel
Head
<br>type though.
<br>Byron
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