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From: "palmers4@rcn.com" <palmers4@rcn.com>
Reply-To: palmers4@rcn.com
Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] JPL Recommendations: Best Buys for 2014:TOP 10 List
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"the people who outbid us then would
probably still be able to outbid us today!" Mostly all true until you get
to=20
this comment,which is mostly untrue, as most of these people who outbid
everyone=20
then are no longer with us. Otherwise well said. David
Original email:
-----------------
From: Jeff Rock rosaamltd@gmail.com
Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2014 21:08:41 -0800
To: colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] JPL Recommendations: Best Buys for
2014:TOP=20
10 List
Randy -- you have significantly more than POS pieces in your collection, so
I will not cry for you! They might SEEM that way only after your eyes are
strained from the glare off Robert Martin's coins, but you have some nice
things. And you've definitely cherry picked some good varieties as well.
You ask if anything is better now than in the 1960s? Well, yes --
KNOWLEDGE. Think about what collectors in the 60's had. If they were
lucky they owned the offprint of the Miller-Ryder book from the ANS --
there were no reprints of Miller available separately until late in that
decade. Photographs? You had the handful of pieces plated in the Miller
offprint and, unless you owned some plate 19th century auction catalogues,
that was it. Rarity ratings and CC information? Weak and non-existent, in
that order. Certain attribution of things? For a lot of Connecs maybe,
but the written descriptions often left room for error -- especially on
lower grade pieces. And let's talk AVAILABILITY as well -- if you were
lucky enough to live in the area, like Bob Vlack did, you would stumble
across things relatively frequently. But let's say you were on the West
Coast in the 60's -- enjoying your Summer of Love! Unless you did a lot of
travel -- expensive, time-consuming travel -- back East, you would be lucky
to see more than a handful of colonials a year locally. By the time you
got your issue of The Numismatist or Numismatic Scrapbook, the few ads that
had colonials in them would have already had them sold. You would be at a
disadvantage bidding in auctions -- colonials were mostly not photographed
(and when they were, weren't done well), and there was no WWW to look at
them online. No e-bay of course. CNL was just started in 1960 and issues
were slim -- and you may not have even heard about the newsletter since it
had a small circulation at the beginning, and unless you knew someone who
got it, you would be out in the cold.
True, things DO cost more now -- and the better things are more hotly
contested (thanks, in good measure, to the sheer amount of new research and
publication that has occurred since the 1960's!). But relatively speaking,
that hasn't changed too much. If you had ten grand to spend on colonials
in 1960 you could have bought quite a lot of nice things. But that $10,000
would have probably been the price of a house in a good area or 300 ounces
of gold. Think of what those things are worth today -- and if you have
half a million to spend on colonials today, you can buy quite a lot of nice
things as well. We have a tendency to look at our incomes today and think
back to the prices of the 70's or 80's and think how much we could have
bought at EAC '75 or Taylor or Norweb or Garrett.....but most of us DIDN'T
have that kind of money back then....the people who outbid us then would
probably still be able to outbid us today!
Jeff
On Thu, Jan 2, 2014 at 7:42 PM, Ray Williams <njraywms@optonline.net> wrote=
:
>
>
> Mike,
> What a nice reply. Your feelings about the hobby reflect those of
> many of us, and you stated it in a polite manner - so typical of you and
> many in C4. Just one problem... I see you enjoy: "*my Mass coppers, and
> Connecticuts, Vermonts, Machins, Canadian tokens, and half cents, etc*.".
> I don't see any NJ Coppers listed there! I feel slighted! You don't own
> any NJs? Just bustin'.
> For those that don't know Mike, his "enjoying Mass Coppers" is an
> *understatement*. I personally consider him to be the resident expert in
> the series. And if I ever had a question about Mass Copper, an email to
> him would be the first thing I'd do. He's written articles and given
> presentations on the topic. And he's one of the nicest guys in our hobby=
!
> Ray
>
>
>
>
> On 1/2/2014 10:22 PM, Michael Packard wrote:
>
> Sorry you feel that way John. Some of us are members of both groups and
> happily so. I enjoy my Mass coppers, and Connecticuts, Vermonts, Machins=
,
> Canadian tokens, and half cents, etc. I was never that serious about
large
> cents, although I have several hundred. Most are destined to be
> "Bangers"--i.e., recycled as counterstamped pocket pieces that I give awa=
y
> at EAC conventions. (Just ask for one if you attend.) I realize that
many
> EACers are very competitive and want to have only the best examples (CC
> level) or all varieties and /or die states, but not everyone plays those
> games. And many who do are very generous in bringing their CC pieces to
> the EAC Happenings for everyone to see, hold, and study. I very much
enjoy
> these collectors and being a member of both EAC and C4. I don't collect
> silver or gold, but I enjoy the people who do, and appreciate looking at
> their exhibits at the coin shows I attend. I don't collect CC pieces
> because I can't afford them, and I don't expect to ever complete any of
the
> series I collect by variety. But for me, that is fine. My thrill is in
> the chase and the expectation that today or tomorrow I'll find something
> I've been looking for or that I never knew existed. You don't need to
feel
> inferior if you weren't near the top of the PENNY CENSUS for middle dates
> or for any other series. The secret to happiness is enjoying what you
have
> and in sharing that sense by being happy and positive with others for wha=
t
> they have collected. I am happy for you that you have found an area that
> fulfills you. That is wonderful. If EAC was not a good memory for you, =
I
> hope you will just let it go. Life is too short to hold grudges,
> especially grudges of this type.
>
> I hope you have a wonderful collecting year in 2014 and add a few
> memorable items to your collections.
>
> Mike P
>
> On Jan 02, 2014, at 08:36 PM, johnmenc@optonline.net wrote:
>
>
>
> Being in the EAC was unfortunately a wasted five years of my collecting
> life in which I was variety collecting so it initially felt good ...
> however I was using only my pocketbook with little or no history behind
the
> coins and comparing myself with others PRIMARILYon a thing THEY CALLED th=
e
> PENNY CENSUSfor Middle Dates. It was horrible ... I only knew that after =
I
> attended the Taylor Sale in 1987 ... my life changed after that sale ...
> forever ... where knowledge and the purse were of EQUAL importance in ALL
> of my collecting ventures ... so I look back and the only word that comes
> to mind is J ... well Button Collectors with DEEP pockets.
>
>
>=20=20
>
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