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Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] RE: Need an Opinion
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From: Ray Williams <njraywms@optonline.net>
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Leo,
Especially in this case, I would make due with the territorial gold
coin. At the time, Sweden was one of the "world powers" and the Baltic
Sea was geographically an inland lake for Sweden. It was during this
time period of your Swedish/German Ducat that the colony of New Sweden
was operating in the New World (Delaware, Pennsylvania & New Jersey). I
wonder if Sweden had a king instead of Christina at the time, if New
Sweden would have survived the Dutch "conquest". But it matters little
as the British would have taken it shortly later in any case. Queen
Christina's reign coincides approximately with the existence of New
Sweden. She is quite a fascinating monarch and you can read much about
her at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christina,_Queen_of_Sweden
Ray
On 2/16/2015 12:10 AM, Rosa Americana rosaamltd@gmail.com
[colonial-coins] wrote:
>
>
> Leo, I agree with Ray -- close enough for horseshoes, and if you have
> the opportunity in the future to get the "real" one that you want,
> then you can sell this other one and be happy. A hole in your
> collection half filled is better than a hole completely empty!
>
> Jeff
>
> On Sun, Feb 15, 2015 at 7:56 PM, Leo Shane leo_j_shane@hotmail.com
> <mailto:leo_j_shane@hotmail.com> [colonial-coins]
> <colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com>> wrote:
>
> All, Sorry to be so evasive. Unfortunately I didn't make my self
> clear, so let me try again. In the assay of September 1776, one
> of the coins mentioned is a Swedish Ducat. This is a gold bullion
> coin of approx. 3.5g. There are also ducats from other countries
> mentioned in the assay. I am trying to get one of every coin in
> this assay and am down to the last two.
>
> One of the coins I need is the Swedish Ducat. I have come across
> a coin minted under the authorization of Sweden in a part of what
> is now Germany. This territory was conquered and occupied by
> Sweden from 1631 to 1648. I am now considering buying a coin
> minted in this occupied territory. Although it is not a duplicate
> design of the coins minted in Sweden, it does have the bust of the
> King of Sweden on the obverse and the inscription identifies the
> King of Sweden also. The reverse shows the coat of arms of the
> King of Sweden. It is a gold bullion coin of the proper weight
> and would probably have circulated along with other bullion coins
> of the 16th and 17th century.
>
> So does this qualify as a Swedish Ducat? What's your opinion?
>
> Thanks
> Leo
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> To: colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com>
> From: colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2015 10:57:43 -0500
>
> Subject: RE: [Colonial Numismatics] RE: Need an Opinion
>
> Leo,
> After thinking about it, I think I know what group you are talking
> about. If it's what I'm thinking about, I face the same decision
> and have decided that the coins produced in the occupied territory
> are theoretically as relevant if not more so. and they are
> usually more affordable.
> Will
>
>
> ---------------------------- Original Message
> ----------------------------
> Subject: RE: [Colonial Numismatics] RE: Need an Opinion
> From: "Leo Shane leo_j_shane@hotmail.com
> <mailto:leo_j_shane@hotmail.com> [colonial-coins]"
> <colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com>>
> Date: Sat, February 14, 2015 9:50 pm
> To: "Colonial Coins Group" <colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com>>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > Bruce / Ray
> > So what you are saying is that the coin minted in an occupied
> territory is only a temporary "hole filler" until one from the
> actual country is found. It would not end your hunt for a coin
> minted in the actual country you are looking for. Is that correct?
> > I wonder what others think.
> > Leo
> >
> > To: colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com>
> >
> From: colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com>
> > Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 20:36:42 -0500
> > Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] RE: Need an Opinion
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi Bruce!
> >
> > Absolutely Lion Dollars circulated here. NY actually printed
> > paper money denominated in Lion Dollars in 1709. There are
> > references to them being in circulation in several colonies and i
> > think that they were so common that someone in Boston was
> > counterfeiting them, but I can't remember where I heard that. So
> > you should have a Lion Dollar ion your collection sitting right next
> > to your 8R type coin. You can read more about the Lion Dollar at
> > the Notre Dame site:
> > http://www.coins.nd.edu/ColCoin/ColCoinIntros/Lion-Dollar.intro.html
> > Lots of good info at that site courtesy of Lou Jordan.
> >
> > Ray
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 2/14/2015 1:31 PM, Bruce Smith
> > bhsmith325@gmail.com <mailto:bhsmith325@gmail.com>
> [colonial-coins] wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi Leo,
> >
> >
> >
> > I'd agree with Ray. The Spanish coins many of us include in
> > our collections were from colonial mints. Articles such as
> > Oliver's on Islamic coins that circulated here expand my
> > understanding of colonial is. I'd like to add a Lion Dollar
> > that was copied in another European state to my collection
> > some time. Sort of the same deal, I'd think. Are any of them
> > known to have circulated here along with the real Netherlands
> > coins?
> >
> >
> >
> > Bruce
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at 12:50 PM, Ray
> > Williams njraywms@optonline.net <mailto:njraywms@optonline.net>
> > [colonial-coins] <colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com>>
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi Leo,
> >
> > I also collect "foreign" coins that circulated
> > in our British American colonies. I would guess
> > that if not too expensive, purchase the coin
> > minted in a possession of the country you want,
> > and make it due until a coin from the actual
> > country becomes available (affordable). If it
> > never becomes available, then you're covered by
> > having one from its possession's mint.
> >
> > I hope you all remembered it's Valentine's
> > Day. If you forgot... it may not be as easy to
> > purchase coins in the future.
> >
> > Ray
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 2/14/2015 12:08 PM, Leo Shane leo_j_shane@hotmail.com
> <mailto:leo_j_shane@hotmail.com>
> > [colonial-coins] wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > I'd like to hear opinions from
> > fellow collectors on the following decision that
> > I have to make. As you know, many coins from
> > Europe and other continents circulated in the
> > Colonies. I am looking to acquire a coin
> > representing a certain country and
> > denomination. I have found a coin that was
> > issued by that country but in an occupied land.
> > Does that qualify as a coin of the country I'm
> > looking for? I have my own opinion and know
> > that we can define our collection any way we
> > want. I was just curious as to what others
> > would say.
> >
> >
> >
> > Stay warm this cold weekend (in the Northeast)
> > and Thanks
> >
> >
> >
> > Leo
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
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Leo,<br>
Especially in this case, I would make due with the territorial
gold coin. At the time, Sweden was one of the "world powers" and
the Baltic Sea was geographically an inland lake for Sweden. It
was during this time period of your Swedish/German Ducat that the
colony of New Sweden was operating in the New World (Delaware,
Pennsylvania & New Jersey). I wonder if Sweden had a king
instead of Christina at the time, if New Sweden would have survived
the Dutch "conquest". But it matters little as the British would
have taken it shortly later in any case. Queen Christina's reign
coincides approximately with the existence of New Sweden. She is
quite a fascinating monarch and you can read much about her at:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christina,_Queen_of_Sweden">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christina,_Queen_of_Sweden</a><br>
Ray<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2/16/2015 12:10 AM, Rosa Americana
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:rosaamltd@gmail.com">rosaamltd@gmail.com</a> [colonial-coins] wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAC7kd3S75uUfQ7imz+0Re3fwkLe0PgYN1yDfakphXWC51b+JTA@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
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<div dir="ltr">
<div>Leo, I agree with Ray -- close enough for horseshoes, and
if you have the opportunity in the future to get the "real"
one that you want, then you can sell this other one and be
happy. A hole in your collection half filled is better than a
hole completely empty!</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Jeff</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Sun, Feb 15, 2015 at 7:56 PM, Leo
Shane <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:leo_j_shane@hotmail.com">leo_j_shane@hotmail.com</a>
[colonial-coins] <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com"
target="_blank">colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
<span> </span>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p>
</p>
<div dir="ltr">All, Sorry to be so evasive.
Unfortunately I didn't make my self clear, so let
me try again. In the assay of September 1776, one
of the coins mentioned is a Swedish Ducat. This
is a gold bullion coin of approx. 3.5g. There are
also ducats from other countries mentioned in the
assay. I am trying to get one of every coin in
this assay and am down to the last two.<br>
<br>
One of the coins I need is the Swedish Ducat. I
have come across a coin minted under the
authorization of Sweden in a part of what is now
Germany. This territory was conquered and
occupied by Sweden from 1631 to 1648. I am now
considering buying a coin minted in this occupied
territory. Although it is not a duplicate design
of the coins minted in Sweden, it does have the
bust of the King of Sweden on the obverse and the
inscription identifies the King of Sweden
also. The reverse shows the coat of arms of the
King of Sweden. It is a gold bullion coin of the
proper weight and would probably have circulated
along with other bullion coins of the 16th and
17th century.<br>
<br>
So does this qualify as a Swedish Ducat? What's
your opinion?<br>
<br>
Thanks<br>
Leo<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<div>
<hr>To: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com"
target="_blank">colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com</a><br>
From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com"
target="_blank">colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com</a><br>
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2015 10:57:43 -0500
<div>
<div class="h5"><br>
Subject: RE: [Colonial Numismatics] RE: Need
an Opinion<br>
<br>
<span> </span>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p>Leo,<br>
After thinking about it, I think I
know what group you are talking
about. If it's what I'm thinking
about, I face the same decision and
have decided that the coins produced
in the occupied territory are
theoretically as relevant if not
more so. and they are usually more
affordable.<br>
Will<br>
<br>
<br>
----------------------------
Original Message
----------------------------<br>
Subject: RE: [Colonial Numismatics]
RE: Need an Opinion<br>
From: "Leo Shane <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:leo_j_shane@hotmail.com"
target="_blank">leo_j_shane@hotmail.com</a>
[colonial-coins]" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com"
target="_blank">colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com</a>><br>
Date: Sat, February 14, 2015 9:50 pm<br>
To: "Colonial Coins Group" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com"
target="_blank">colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com</a>><br>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
> Bruce / Ray<br>
> So what you are saying is that
the coin minted in an occupied
territory is only a temporary "hole
filler" until one from the actual
country is found. It would not end
your hunt for a coin minted in the
actual country you are looking for.
Is that correct?<br>
> I wonder what others think.<br>
> Leo<br>
><br>
> To: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com</a><br>
><br>
From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com"
target="_blank">colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com</a><br>
> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 20:36:42
-0500<br>
> Subject: Re: [Colonial
Numismatics] RE: Need an Opinion<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Hi Bruce!<br>
><br>
> Absolutely Lion Dollars
circulated here. NY actually printed<br>
> paper money denominated in Lion
Dollars in 1709. There are<br>
> references to them being in
circulation in several colonies and
i<br>
> think that they were so common
that someone in Boston was<br>
> counterfeiting them, but I
can't remember where I heard that.
So<br>
> you should have a Lion Dollar
ion your collection sitting right
next
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