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Full-name: CMcdon0923
Message-ID: <bc7ee.6f27b5d1.42e91a60@aol.com>
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2015 13:48:16 -0400
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Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Symposium on Cft half pence
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And while we might understand us all not being invited to the ceremony, we =
=20
do expect to be invited to the reception. Free food and an open bar !!!!!
=20
....just not during the auction.
=20
=20
Craig
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
In a message dated 7/28/2015 12:42:31 P.M. Central Daylight Time,=20=20
colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com writes:
=20
=20
=20
Now that's the best suggestion I've read yet Roger!!!=20=20
=20
gary :-)
=20
=20
In a message dated 7/28/2015 1:13:18 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,=20=20
colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com writes:
=20
Or have the wedding in Baltimore.=20
=20
You'll need to skip out of the bourse for a few hours, but=20=20
otherwise......two birds with one stone !!!!
=20
=20
Craig
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
In a message dated 7/28/2015 12:06:29 P.M. Central Daylight Time,=20=20
colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com writes:
=20
=20
Exactly! Wait a decade, you can easily wait another week or two! And you=
=20
can always cut him out of the will if he does do it that same week! <g>
Jeff
On Tue, Jul 28, 2015 at 9:51 AM, Ray Williams _njraywms@optonline.net_=20
(mailto:njraywms@optonline.net) [colonial-coins]=20
<_colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com) >=
wrote:
=20
=20
=20
Yes!=20=20
What Craig said!
Ray
=20
=20
=20
On Tue, Jul 28, 2015 at 12:39 PM, _CMcdon0923@aol.com_=20
(mailto:CMcdon0923@aol.com) [colonial-coins] wrote:=20=20
Just tell him that the weekend of C4 is off limits, so have the wedding it=
=20
in October or wait until AFTER the Convention.
=20
After 10 years, they apparently aren't in any real hurry.=20=20=20
Craig
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
In a message dated 7/28/2015 11:22:03 A.M. Central Daylight Time,=20=20
_colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com) w=
rites:
=20
LOL!! Ray, No formal announcement yet but after 10 years of dating the=20
same girl, I understand through the grapevine that my son is finally going=
to=20
pull the trigger - October or November. I will believe it when I see it. =
=20
In any case that will trump all other occasions. Something my wife and=
=20
I thought we would not be alive to see!! R
Sent from my iPhone
On Jul 28, 2015, at 12:00 PM, Ray Williams _njraywms@optonline.net_=20
(mailto:njraywms@optonline.net) [colonial-coins] <_colonial-coins@yahoogro=
ups.com_=20
(mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com) > wrote:
=20
Roger,=20
Where are your priorities??? Symposium or not, family and friends should=
=20
know you well enough not to schedule a wedding on the dates of a C4=20=20
Convention!!! If they don't know you that well, then your attendance at t=
he=20
wedding isn't important to them, so don't feel bad about missing the event=
.
Ray
=20
On Tue, Jul 28, 2015 at 11:12 AM, Roger Moore _rogermoore435@yahoo.com_=20
(mailto:rogermoore435@yahoo.com) [colonial-coins] wrote:=20=20
Hi Jeff, I have only had a response from Rickie in regard to giving a=20
Simian or AG update. I have no feedback in regard to a time or place. I=
=20
wonder if we shouldn't be more Brit like in planning ahead!! Also there m=
ay=20
be a wrench in this for me since there may be a marriage coming (long in=20
coming) that will interfere but the date is not settled yet. If I can g=
o I=20
would ber glad to give an update on one of the Families I have studied. =
=20
Roger
=20
=20=20
____________________________________
From: "Rosa Americana _rosaamltd@gmail.com_ (mailto:rosaamltd@gmail.com) =
=20
[colonial-coins]" <_colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com_=20
(mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com) >
To: _colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com_=20
(mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com)=20=20
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2015 2:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Symposium on Cft half pence
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
Hey Rick! I think the discussions of something at C4 are pretty=20
preliminary at this point. We need someone to do some of the work to get =
it started=20
-- we volunteered Roger, since he is good at stuff like that! But I=20=20
suspect it won't be for at least a month before anything starts getting do=
ne.=20=20
We don't have the patience that you Brits do to start planning things out =
a=20
year in advance like the Congress! If it DOES happen, it will be in=20
either one of the rooms at the convention center OR in someone's hotel --=
there=20
won't be an area to set up things for sale there, but if you are set up at=
=20
the Baltimore show already then you will have a table and I'm sure would=20
be able to sell some material! We still need to see who will be able to =
=20
make it out this year, and if enough people can't, then it maybe gets push=
ed=20
to next year.
Roger, have you had any feedback?
Jeff
On Mon, Jul 27, 2015 at 11:02 AM, rick coleman _r99cc@yahoo.com_=20
(mailto:r99cc@yahoo.com) [colonial-coins] <_colonial-coins@yahoogroups.co=
m_=20
(mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com) > wrote:
=20
=20
=20
=20
Hi Jeff, your book has gone off...is the C4 cft room likely? I would for=
=20
sure have a table or appear there if it goes ahead. I've sold 3/4 of the=20
run of books already so may do a reprint special edition especially for th=
e=20
C4...with updates of the two dozen cfts I've bought in June and July...wou=
ld=20
be thrilled to use any images of coins from your collection if poss?=20
Would mention you in the credits and post you a couple of the updated book=
:-)=20
Best wishes Rick
=20
=20=20
____________________________________
From: "Rosa Americana _rosaamltd@gmail.com_ (mailto:rosaamltd@gmail.com) =
=20
[colonial-coins]" <_colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com_=20
(mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com) >
To: _colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com_=20
(mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com)=20=20
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2015 6:10 PM
Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Symposium on Cft half pence
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
Of course in that situation it screws the family out of a $30 million-plus=
=20
windfall (figuring that the prices would drop to a few million apiece for=
=20
this hoard), and the US legal system does tend to protect private property=
=20=20
rights. I'm sure there will be years of appeals on it!
Looking forward to seeing your book, Rick! Did you get my shipping=20
address?
Jeff
On Tue, Jul 14, 2015 at 6:21 AM, rick coleman _r99cc@yahoo.com_=20
(mailto:r99cc@yahoo.com) [colonial-coins] <_colonial-coins@yahoogroups.co=
m_=20
(mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com) > wrote:
=20
=20
=20
=20
Yeah, interesting situation, I suppose if they go into the Smithsonian it =
=20
may not affect the value too much of that single 20 dollar! Best wishes=20
Rick=20
------------------------------
=20
On Tue, Jul 14, 2015 5:04 AM BST Rosa Americana _rosaamltd@gmail.com_=20
(mailto:rosaamltd@gmail.com) [colonial-coins] wrote:
>well on that one the others did turn up and were quickly confiscated. Th=
e
>court battles may not be over on them, but so far they haven't been found
>legal to own -- they may end up in the Smithsonian instead of melted,=20
which
>would still make the other one the only piece legal to own. But it is
>reported that there are others out there as well, which will come up if
>this group is allowed to be sold privately. The American legal system wil=
l
>grind through it slowly I am sure -- too bad there aren't many judges
>acquainted with numismatics!
>
>On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 3:27 PM, rick coleman _r99cc@yahoo.com_=20
(mailto:r99cc@yahoo.com)=20
>[colonial-coins] <_colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com_=20
(mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com) > wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> So true Jeff, I remember a British dealer selling a UNIQUE EXAMPLE OF A
>> COIN not in a museum...1933 double eagle, for 14 million, then 5 years=
=20
ago
>> another half dozen turned up! Egg on someone's face! Best wishes Rick
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 7:53 PM BST Rosa Americana _rosaamltd@gmail.com_=20
(mailto:rosaamltd@gmail.com)=20
>> [colonial-coins] wrote:
>>
>> >Rick, that is really the reason that we collect the stuff we do. It =
=20
is not
>> >mainstream and, even if we all made our best efforts, never will=20
be....and
>> >that is fine with me. It means that it remains a special subset of tru=
e
>> >collectors and researchers, and one that is still affordable. Unless=20
one
>> >is really lucky or really rich, the chance of adding a near-unique
>> colonial
>> >are slim at best. But things go in the two and three (very rarely four=
=20
and
>> >almost never five) figures for extremely rare counterfeits, and that i=
s
>> >exciting to me as a collector!
>> >
>> >I do always quibble with "unique" -- since things like this were made=
=20
to
>> >circulate, not to sell at a premium to collectors or as patterns, etc.
>> then
>> >more than one would have been struck. I suspect that there are very=20
few
>> >truly unique counterfeits out there, and when we see one it is usually=
=20
a
>> >case that we've only seen that one example and others exist in other
>> >collections. A fair amount of the new "unique" discoveries has seen
>> >another example (or more) show up within a few years. Given that we=20
still
>> >don't know what exists in a lot of UK collections, I definitely=20=20
prefer to
>> >err on the side of caution and say "extremely rare" or maybe even
>> >"currently unique" for stuff like this!
>> >
>> >Jeff
>> >
>> >On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 2:09 AM, rick coleman _r99cc@yahoo.com_=20
(mailto:r99cc@yahoo.com)=20
>> >[colonial-coins] <_colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com_=20
(mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com) > wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > So true Jeff, you and I and probably all of us have at this time=20
UNIQUE
>> > pieces, if they were mainstream collector coins they'd be 6 or 7
>> figures,
>> > yet some we'd struggle to get a thousand for! Yet a conventional coi=
n
>> with
>> > a million mintage in a plastic lump saying its a unique high grade ca=
n
>> > fetch six figures? Best wishes Rick
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 3:47 AM BST Rosa Americana _rosaamltd@gmail.com_=
=20
(mailto:rosaamltd@gmail.com)=20
>> > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> >
>> > >Ray, IF you could only catalogue things that interested you that=20
would
>> be
>> > >great. But unfortunately if you work for an auction house you=20
catalogue
>> > >what comes in -- for every collection of NJ coppers or cool
>> counterfeits
>> > >that came in you would probably have 10,000 slabbed Morgan dollars. =
=20
And
>> > >how many times can you say "rare" without laughing to yourself about
>> how
>> > >common that crap really is compared to the stuff we all collect? I
>> think
>> > >someone like Hodder or Kraljevich really shows their skills when the=
y
>> get
>> > a
>> > >collection like Fords, etc. But when it's just humrum stuff you star=
t
>> > >seeing those short 2-sentence descriptions, and that is just darned
>> boring
>> > >to do (and to read).
>> > >
>> > >Jeff
>> > >
>> > >On Sun, Jul 12, 2015 at 7:06 PM, rick coleman _r99cc@yahoo.com_=20
(mailto:r99cc@yahoo.com)=20
>> > >[colonial-coins] <_colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com_=20
(mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com) > wrote:
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Hi Ray, so true, 90% is bread and butter bullion and general
>> collectors
>> > > coins but occasionally my jaw would drop at a collection! I valued =
a
>> > > collection in Dublin ten years ago of choice UNC guineas, every yea=
r
>> > made
>> > > from 1662, in the Bank of Ireland, the vendor was over 90 but=20
wouldn't
>> > > sell, was Still upgrading!' I'd love to hear what came of it!! Bes=
t
>> > wishes
>> > > Rick
>> > >
>> > > ------------------------------
>> > >
>> > > On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 2:29 AM BST Ray Williams=20
_njraywms@optonline.net_ (mailto:njraywms@optonline.net)=20
>> > > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > >
>> > > >I recognize two of the auction house names - haven't heard of
>> Phillips.
>> > > >That's some nice info to have on a resume. I would think that
>> > > >cataloging could be fun, but I've heard some catalogers talk about=
=20
it
>> > > >being drudgery. I guess like any job - you like it or you don't.
>> > > >Thanks for getting back
>> > > >Ray
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > On Sun, Jul 12, 2015 at 05:46 PM, rick coleman _r99cc@yahoo.com_=
=20
(mailto:r99cc@yahoo.com)=20
>> > > >[colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > Hi Ray, only Phillips, Glendinings and Sovereign Auctions, all
>> London
>> > > > based
>> > > >
>> > > > ------------------------------
>> > > > On Sun, Jul 12, 2015 7:32 PM BST Ray Williams
>> _njraywms@optonline.net_ (mailto:njraywms@optonline.net)=20
>> > > > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > Cool,
>> > > > Have you done any auction catalogs that might be in my library?
>> > > > Ray
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > On Sun, Jul 12, 2015 at 09:29 AM, rick coleman _r99cc@yahoo.com_=
=20
(mailto:r99cc@yahoo.com)=20
>> > > > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > Hi Ray, I've been logging Ebay and UK dealers sales plus what I'v=
e
>> > > > had to pay for cfts and evasions over the decade, I've paid over
>> > > > =C2=A31000 on a few lustrous or rare ones. Prices are in VG, F, V=
F and=20
EF
>> > > > with a guide to judging grades as the coins were often=20
deliberately
>> > > > aged, priced in USD. I have over 600 cfts myself so they proved
>> > > > useful in compiling the book, I'm an auction cataloguer myself so
>> > > > editing etc was no problem. The first 50 pages are the History of
>> > > > Counterfeiting and a guide to spotting differences. I'll post a
>> > > > contents page soon as I get home next week buddy! Best wishes Ric=
k
>> > > >
>> > > > ------------------------------
>> > > > On Sun, Jul 12, 2015 1:00 PM BST Ray Williams
>> _njraywms@optonline.net_ (mailto:njraywms@optonline.net)=20
>> > > > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > Rick,
>> > > > This sounds like just what the hobby needs! I've wanted the
>> > > > ctft chat groups to do this for over a decade. Who did you use to
>> > > > do the editing? What did you use for the price guide? Auctions?
>> > > > Ebay? Could you post the table of contents?
>> > > > Ray
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > On Sun, Jul 12, 2015 at 07:51 AM, rick coleman _r99cc@yahoo.com_=
=20
(mailto:r99cc@yahoo.com)=20
>> > > > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > Hi Roger, I've written it over the past decade, about quarter fro=
m
>> > > > my collection, others from friends etc, dates from 1700 to 1822
>> > > > with all major varieties I came across. Over 1000 images of cfts
>> > > > and evasions. Galata Publishers and Clem kindly gave me the use o=
f
>> > > > their images. Token Publishers in Honiton, Devon published it las=
t
>> > > > week and are selling well. Retail 50USD but Forum members its=20
40USD
>> > > > plus post. Its really to encourage new collectors plus set a pric=
e
>> > > > guide for existing coins. Let me know if you'd like a copy! Bed
>> > > > wishes Rick
>> > > >
>> > > > ------------------------------
>> > > > On Sun, Jul 12, 2015 3:22 AM BST _rogermoore435@yahoo.com_=20
(mailto:rogermoore435@yahoo.com)=20
>> > > > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > Hi Rickie. I did not know about book. Who printed it? Who
>> > > > authored it? What was it on? Roger
>> > > >
>> > > > Sent from my iPhone
>> > > >
>> > > > On Jul 11, 2015, at 6:56 PM, rick coleman _r99cc@yahoo.com_=20
(mailto:r99cc@yahoo.com)=20
>> > > > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > Hi Roger, great idea, I'll try to make it ! I wonder if we=20
combined
>> > > > the cfts with update on evasions we'd have more attendance? I've
>> > > > just finished stalling out at the summer FUN show were I sold out
>> > > > the 150 copies of newly printed book COUNTERFEIT GEORGIAN COPPER
>> > > > COINS so hopefully we'd get more than 25 attending Regards Rick
>> > > > ------------------------------
>> > > > On Sat, Jul 11, 2015 11:43 PM BST rick coleman _r99cc@yahoo.com_=
=20
(mailto:r99cc@yahoo.com)=20
>> > > > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > ------------------------------
>> > > > On Sat, Jul 11, 2015 8:59 PM BST _rogermoore435@yahoo.com_=20
(mailto:rogermoore435@yahoo.com)=20
>> > > > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > Ray, my guess is the actual participants and additional people
>> > > > would be only 25 or so but I agree we need to get a commitment.=20
But
>> > > > to get a commitment we need to know the time that is open since
>> > > > some will be tied up at the bourse or not be able to attend at=20
that
>> > > > time. Sort of a catch 22. In any case if my suggest goes over lik=
e
>> > > > a lead ballon, we need go no further. Roger
>> > > >
>> > > > Sent from my iPhone
>> > > >
>> > > > On Jul 11, 2015, at 3:43 PM, Ray Williams=20
_njraywms@optonline.net_ (mailto:njraywms@optonline.net)=20
>> > > > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > Hi Roger,
>> > > > Let me try again... It sounds like a good idea. I don't know what
>> > > > time lengths are available for the room. Lets see how many you ge=
t
>> > > > to commit to attend. I'm sure we'll be able to figure out any
>> > > > needed A/V. Post also to contemporary cfts too. Jeff Lipsky has
>> > > > been working hard on educational events and already has a schedul=
e
>> > > > of speakers. So when you have numbers and know what you'd like to
>> > > > accomplish, we can work on how to do it. But don't dawdle.
>> > > > Ray
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > On Sat, Jul 11, 2015 at 02:40 PM, _rogermoore435@yahoo.com_=20
(mailto:rogermoore435@yahoo.com)=20
>> > > > [colonial-coins] wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > It sounds like people have an interest in getting together at C4
>> > > > for
>> > > > a cft symposium. First in this process would be to get a time tha=
t
>> > > > we could meet. I was thinking three hours would be good, if we
>> > > > could get 5 or 6 volunteers to give a Family update. Longer if a
>> > > > lot of people wanted to speak about a Family. Before going any
>> > > > father in regard to who will speak on what, we need the conventio=
n
>> > > > organizers to give us time slots for a room that would be open fo=
r
>> > > > three hours and could accommodate (20? 30? Less?) people. For=20
those
>> > > > interested what are your feelings about this? If talks are going=
=20
to
>> > > > be given, some sort of screen and digital projector will be=20
needed.
>> > > > Ray, are you involved with this C4 meeting? If not, whom should w=
e
>> > > > contact? Just thought that if we were going to do this we need to
>> > > > get it organized early. We could also put together a booklet of
>> > > > plates for the Families we discuss for sale by C4 to anyone else
>> > > > interested. Just a thought. Roger
>> > > >
>> > > > Sent from my iPhone
>> > > >
>> > > > ------------------------------------
>> > > > Posted by: _rogermoore435@yahoo.com_=20
(mailto:rogermoore435@yahoo.com)=20
>> > > > ------------------------------------
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > ------------------------------------
>> > > >
>> > > > Yahoo Groups Links
>> > > >
>> > > >
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>> > > >
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>> > > >
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>> > > >
>> > > > ------------------------------------
>> > > > Posted
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