| Contenido del artículo |
- From njraywms@optonline.net Thu Oct 08 04:40:45 2015
Return-Path: <njraywms@optonline.net>
X-Sender: njraywms@optonline.net
X-Apparently-To: colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com
X-Received: (qmail 64568 invoked by uid 102); 8 Oct 2015 11:40:45 -0000
X-Received: from unknown (HELO mtaq6.grp.bf1.yahoo.com) (10.193.84.37)
by m14.grp.bf1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Oct 2015 11:40:45 -0000
X-Received: (qmail 10249 invoked from network); 8 Oct 2015 11:40:45 -0000
X-Received: from unknown (HELO mta1002.groups.mail.bf1.yahoo.com) (98.139.170.166)
by mtaq6.grp.bf1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Oct 2015 11:40:45 -0000
X-Original-Return-Path: <njraywms@optonline.net>
X-Received-SPF: none (domain of optonline.net does not designate permitted sender hosts)
X-YMailISG: UdPWHO4WLDtEPfhNiUy9U6vmww5wNQkC6xDnDtUjGqFGs0qK
mNF1irL2EnG2uzEGVAlj0Emwzei0mQ5fJaEMH8XSW3B1hl96ll4aN_TVOCnV
DAM__NE9NHlroF1Q_VJQYZScWQTHNyG_jnypv9Tz2PG6_Js4oTRLZPWl0GLs
1fbVMX8lc2W6wFVR9W5YrVb1nQ5khnG.kmCZ8sRVry0a2ILPVh8nwX6tNAcQ
elP3ndGLDlWv9zcTO4jKeO3IhvC4wAxJQZ9XkTK7OraZ1C50WqsKuviDLxzA
3.VudKvfAMpegvL8kG3ZhJzq2otlGWHVaphJ3g2liIWI5vUfHfBwEWf5mLh0
NyBmG66j6Vj0SW02skTDwjX2fQhIudYcB4Cz.IiUI8MzlVRSoLSYUSOIc4zs
s1__XqzzfUlJ_Zh.JiHuQz8_l6vd.tDXMWZt5sZuV34PZbLiZ2YrIkKzLITj
BaX4ju14nCWglZS0tyIzgPELo4SzagJWwh9FG4JNHztxTBf4mr0VC1VpFSkf
qauvH6TSJbHx3kh9EdWK5lvVLajpvXQxzKnh2cfWfb57XkSuxtUOVcOjkppR
O_jbRiZ5Q2AiFBHjUWOHQqZpOpvk2jSY7ErpAsupE1pTe35bNdvI8Dp39GjT
v0ULX7Omm0xubD8iOGmGYFljoNn7D63upMWgmPuGrYSqVwnKvptnO54il7QG
u8lLRWHqfGakKfhHXkXUsr4VOI3MowSMd7I54WnA2b_JT3MRPYkRwN1fpQLW
nw.GcVwtPNX01dBEt9T9zsIlpI50.3_WFgerAbQdRj9p6Ic4UgGTuM4bLZsC
oumAwhgV3e0h.Ha5Knz.1BZ7AusIRgybrGhf8k4yCdjB83099LDy_OJYhnCU
_2Bu639SnSmHhjMHbtmQ.p.QW7jeLeqWt9u_P0FZUgNRu1T3HmyHZk0OL.fI
gSmBlQvN2cXe65PS308W5StULwVdR7VaLCqk99W1PnLf1J_t3UW5dvmAGoMm
uVfoAO3dHE4gvA8YEHyTYTSHFO8WNCzgAytH69_qAl698RFxIL5al54jWZHZ
hGLvZH5_63221Y_iKiZ1.Y.93UMlWKXGBgQc74dwdRSVXlTz8RHPYkHzenSA
c5M_Ko_ChMo0YjdLOkYkOuNmSM5ZhUTvFKluy_oOqLpr3ZmiIPNuOBNSJMIA
Sq.ptq6okEpaP6ofRXQHWbfbQDoD6W3YOyYU5FDdiUlyYWGqJBpnuu._sAi5
E3B3nXu88ENPEp3pHygMImG1YAtbsIkoqdE6FR_hZ7zO4yAaXbyHjXRG.2kX
VwiWNSUd8ZMtpb5Xu5ADDFviGIBQomYiZWmPs1QDKZDY4E1lIUa5qhqu1f7z
VzM3erTA1dnUMO.jRxEPdkPlwf9FwEhKXYkpS4A0.FAKmqzRULwmC67ltYUl
AcTFQezK6PlYGh4dqlW3K7pblry5mtJL.KLqEhiyAM4pqL0My7AlMRTLnUFi
QA8GhHnwPhRXJNAIIzC0_bt36VTawFth3htaFUkp7y7oiz8979EYlwVT107r
iqij.ViaQYRGt1Bxt2PhxM9vNqSfbfin0Da.mHIj.nnj54Py_xAVxcp.fUe0
RHlA7e..48r2XeVnLg0zADlpTLRgp52zGXvZA6rV8vQP9qumtYhQ6WeoZ7UR
gkSErwbhCmcbMEo6QZVbHvdSUrTexWhC92_HSQlgMe1rFdb7ErXyMDGv4KUY
KGGWEwMS7SYE73GlxsJgp9IQDNfzHg4PJw--
Authentication-Results: mta1002.groups.mail.bf1.yahoo.com from=optonline.net; domainkeys=neutral (no sig); from=optonline.net; dkim=neutral (no sig)
X-Received: from 127.0.0.1 (EHLO mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net) (167.206.4.199)
by mta1002.groups.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with SMTP; Thu, 08 Oct 2015 11:40:42 +0000
X-Received: from vwm28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net
(vwm28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.10.58]) by mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net
(Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-8.04 (built Feb 28 2007))
with ESMTPA id <0NVW0065EGFUIE70@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for
colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com; Thu, 08 Oct 2015 07:40:42 -0400 (EDT)
X-Received: from [174.44.82.55] by webtop.webmail.optimum.net with HTTP; Thu,
08 Oct 2015 07:40:42 -0400
Date: Thu, 08 Oct 2015 07:40:42 -0400 (EDT)
In-reply-to: <00d186ca-6027-46bf-bb37-77fced04fa08@me.com>
To: "colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com"
<colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com>
Message-id: <1031ffb1.1cf85.1504740d365.Webtop.58@optonline.net>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="Boundary_(ID_L0snRRqOwb85wlw3VR7L0Q)"
X-Priority: 3
X-SID: 58
X-Authuserid: njraywms@optonline.net
References: <35f092.1cd083d7.4347128a@aol.com>
<00d186ca-6027-46bf-bb37-77fced04fa08@me.com>
User-Agent: Laszlo Mail 3
X-Originating-IP: 98.139.170.166
Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Re: Colonial Copper over-strikes
X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=78843690; y=8hoXuNRk1axJAMIAoyADfXhSkbNMoDrNoOKELzLWbLgK
X-Yahoo-Profile: njray2
From: Ray Williams <njraywms@optonline.net>
--Boundary_(ID_L0snRRqOwb85wlw3VR7L0Q)
Content-type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Content-disposition: inline
Great info Mike,
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 I knew that the MA Coppers were the best of the st=
ate coppers with=20
respect to quality control.=C2=A0 I didn't know the rest.=C2=A0 It would ma=
ke=20
agood article.
Thanks
Ray
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
On Wed, Oct 07, 2015 at 11:38 PM, Michael Packard mpackard3@mac.com=20
[colonial-coins] wrote:
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
Jack,
Usually you can see some of the undertype--most often part of the=20
Eagle's wing or a talon and some of the arrow shafts, as on this piece,=20
but sometimes part of the Indian or letters. =C2=A0=C2=A0
All the 16.3-Ns struck over Massachusetts cents that I could attribute=20
have been struck over 1787 Ryder 1-B cents. =C2=A0I know of about 14 1-B=20
cents and 25-30 examples that were host planchets for 16.3-Ns. =C2=A0I'm=20
confident that there are more of each waiting to be discovered.
I've seen few error coins in the Massachusetts copper series. =C2=A0The mos=
t=20
common error, by far, is clipped planchets. =C2=A0I've seen two half cent=20
pieforts (half cents struck on cent-thickness planchets). =C2=A0 I think=20
these and a white metal half cent were test strikes. =C2=A0I've also seen=20
three off-center strikes--one about 40% off-center--and two about 5%=20
off-center. =C2=A0All are 1788 Ryder 3-E cents. =C2=A0My theory
is that the coiner got his fingers pinched and was very tentative when=20
inserting the next few planchets into the press. =C2=A0I haven't found a=20
blood-stained 3-E to support this, however. =C2=A0I've never seen a=20
double-struck or brockage Massachusetts copper nor one struck over=20
another coin. =C2=A0(I did once see a reference to a US half cent struck ov=
er=20
a Massachusetts half cent, but have never been able to track it down.)=20
=C2=A0Some Massachusetts coppers have planchet problems--striations,=20
laminations and de-laminations, non-copper metal inclusions from=20
incomplete or careless smelting, and variable thickness planchets that=20
cause obverse and reverse striking weakness in the thin areas. =C2=A0I=20
hesitate to call these errors because they are not the result of=20
striking problems. =C2=A0I'd like to hear form anyone who has, or has seen,=
=20
Massachusetts copper errors other than clips.
Mike P
On Oct 07, 2015, at 08:28 PM, "Gry1564@aol.com
[colonial-coins]" <colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
=C2=A0
Bunch of Arrows on the Obv. bust.
=C2=A0
In a message dated 10/7/2015 8:23:08 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,=20
colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com <mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com>=20
writes:
=C2=A0
I noticed in the April 2006 Colonial Newsletter there is mention of 1788=20
Connecticut 16.3-N struck over a 1787 counterfeit Massachusetts cent;=20
the attached pic is of an auction listed 16.3-N claimed to be struck=20
over a Massachusetts cent- how can you tell from the pics?
Best,
Jack
--Boundary_(ID_L0snRRqOwb85wlw3VR7L0Q)
Content-type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Content-disposition: inline
Great info Mike,</div><div> I knew that the MA Copp=
ers were the best of the state coppers with respect to quality control.&nbs=
p; I didn't know the rest. It would make agood article.</div><div>Tha=
nks</div><div>Ray</div><div style=3D"font-family: Verdana;"><div> </di=
v><div> </div><div> </div>On Wed, Oct 07, 2015 at 11:38 PM, Micha=
el Packard mpackard3@mac.com [colonial-coins] wrote:<div> </div><div>&=
nbsp;</div><blockquote style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1e=
x; border-left-color: rgb(136, 136, 136); border-left-width: 2px; border-le=
ft-style: solid;">
<br><br>
<div><div>Jack,</div><div><br></div><div>Usually you can see some of the un=
dertype--most often part of the Eagle's wing or a talon and some of the arr=
ow shafts, as on this piece, but sometimes part of the Indian or letters. &=
nbsp; </div><div><br></div><div>All the 16.3-Ns struck over Massachuse=
tts cents that I could attribute have been struck over 1787 Ryder 1-B cents=
. I know of about 14 1-B cents and 25-30 examples that were host plan=
chets for 16.3-Ns. I'm confident that there are more of each waiting =
to be discovered.</div><div><br></div><div>I've seen few error coins in the=
Massachusetts copper series. The most common error, by far, is clipp=
ed planchets. I've seen two half cent pieforts (half cents struck on =
cent-thickness planchets). I think these and a white metal half cent=
were test strikes. I've also seen three off-center strikes--one abou=
t 40% off-center--and two about 5% off-center. All are 1788 Ryder 3-E=
cents. My theory
is that the coiner got his fingers pinched and was very tentative when ins=
erting the next few planchets into the press. I haven't found a blood=
-stained 3-E to support this, however. I've never seen a double-struc=
k or brockage Massachusetts copper nor one struck over another coin. =
(I did once see a reference to a US half cent struck over a Massachusetts h=
alf cent, but have never been able to track it down.) Some Massachuse=
tts coppers have planchet problems--striations, laminations and de-laminati=
ons, non-copper metal inclusions from incomplete or careless smelting, and =
variable thickness planchets that cause obverse and reverse striking weakne=
ss in the thin areas. I hesitate to call these errors because they ar=
e not the result of striking problems. I'd like to hear form anyone w=
ho has, or has seen, Massachusetts copper errors other than clips.</div><di=
v><br></div><div>Mike P</div></div><div><br>On Oct 07, 2015, at 08:28 PM, "=
Gry1564@aol.com
[colonial-coins]" <colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com> wrote:<br><br></d=
iv><div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div class=3D"msg-quote" style=3D"backgro=
und-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" data-mce-style=3D"background-color: #fff;">=
<span style=3D"display: none;" data-mce-style=3D"display: none;"> </sp=
an><div id=3D"ygrp-mlmsg" style=3D"position: relative;" data-mce-style=3D"p=
osition: relative;"><div id=3D"ygrp-msg" style=3D"z-index: 1;" data-mce-sty=
le=3D"z-index: 1;"><div id=3D"ygrp-text"><p><br></p><div><span id=3D"role_d=
ocument" style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial; font-size: small=
;" color=3D"#000000" size=3D"3" data-mce-style=3D"color: #000000; font-fami=
ly: Arial; font-size: small;" face=3D"Arial">Bunch of Arrows on the Obv. bu=
st.</span></div><div> </div><div><div>In a message dated 10/7/2015 8:2=
3:08 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, <a href=3D"mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogrou=
ps.com" data-mce-href=3D"mailto:colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com">colonial-co=
ins@yahoogroups.com</a> writes:</div><blockquote style=3D"margin-left: 5px;=
border-left-color: blue; border-left-width: 2px; border-left-style: solid;=
" data-mce-style=3D"border-left: blue 2px solid; margin-left: 5px;"><span s=
tyle=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial; font-size: x-small; backgr=
ound-color: transparent;" color=3D"#000000" size=3D"2" data-mce-style=3D"ba=
ckground-color: transparent; color: #000000; font-family: Arial; font-size:=
x-small;" face=3D"Arial"><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: =
Arial; font-size: x-small; background-color: transparent;" color=3D"#000000=
" size=3D"2" data-mce-style=3D"background-color: transparent; color: #00000=
0; font-family: Arial; font-size: x-small;" face=3D"Arial"><span> </sp=
an></span></span><div id=3D"ygrp-text"><p>I noticed in the April 2006 Colon=
ial Newsletter there is mention of 1788 Connecticut 16.3-N struck over a 17=
87 counterfeit Massachusetts cent; the attached pic is of an auction listed=
16.3-N claimed to be struck over a Massachusetts cent- how can you tell fr=
om the pics?<br><br>Best,<br><br>Jack</p></div></blockquote></div><p><br></=
p></div><div style=3D"height: 0px; color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" data-mce-sty=
le=3D"color: #fff; height: 0;"></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div>
<br>
<br>
<div style=3D"color: white; clear: both;" width=3D"1"></div>
</blockquote>
--Boundary_(ID_L0snRRqOwb85wlw3VR7L0Q)--
|
|---|
