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Reply-To: James Higby <earlyamericancoppers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Scary
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From: James Higby <earlyamericancoppers@yahoo.com>
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Yet.
From: "Ray Williams njraywms@optonline.net [colonial-coins]" <colonia=
l-coins@yahoogroups.com>
To: "colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com" <colon=
ial-coins@yahoogroups.com>=20
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2015 9:47 AM
Subject: Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Scary
=20=20=20
=C2=A0 There's something to be said for buying well provenanced coins fro=
m reputable dealers who will make good if there's a problem.=C2=A0 I'm glad=
I don't collect a modernseries of coins where dependency on third party gr=
ading is necessary.=C2=A0 Not that there aren't colonial fakes - China is m=
aking them, but in general, they're not deceptive.=C2=A0 Ray
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0On Sat, Nov 21, 2015 at 10:32 AM, James Higby earlyameric=
ancoppers@yahoo.com [colonial-coins] wrote:=C2=A0=C2=A0
Several years ago a dealer friend and I had a discussion of this very pheno=
menon, which has been going on for=C2=A0quite some time.=C2=A0 And every ti=
me there is online discussion, the slab counterfeiters and coin counterfeit=
ers take heed and correct their "errors."=C2=A0=C2=A0As they get better and=
better at their craft, there remain fewer and fewer who can tell the diffe=
rence.=C2=A0 Evidence exists that already both major slabbing companies hav=
e been fooled.=C2=A0 PCGS was set up at the=C2=A0Chicago International Coin=
Fair four years ago with a display of their own slabs that had fake or alt=
ered coins in them.=C2=A0 This raises the conundrum, "Can a fake coin (or f=
ake slab) be made so well that no one except the faker can tell the differe=
nce?"=C2=A0 That question, of course, has no answer, but the implications a=
re chilling, to say the least.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
=C2=A0 From: "Ray Williams njraywms@optonline.net [colonial-coins]" <c=
olonial-coins@yahoogroups.com>
To: "colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com" <colon=
ial-coins@yahoogroups.com>=20
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2015 1:36 PM
Subject: [Colonial Numismatics] Scary
=20=20=20
=C2=A0 Hi Guys,
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 This is not colonial but it is scary!=C2=A0 A coun=
terfeit coin in a=20
counterfeit slab!=C2=A0 Although not on the below link, I think I heard tha=
t=20
the NGC number matches the coin and grade of a real slabbed coin.=C2=A0 So=
=20
how do we defend ourselves?=C2=A0 I don't have the answer.=C2=A0 If a coin =
dealer=20
is offered something like this, how can they tell it's bad.=C2=A0 Most peop=
le=20
just assume that if it's in plastic, it's good.=C2=A0
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 So if some of my friends out there are investing i=
n slabbed gold or=20
silver, be careful.=C2=A0 Get receipts, from reputable dealers, that itemiz=
e=20
the slab numbers.=C2=A0
Have fun out there!
Ray
=20=20
=20=20=20
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=20=20
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<html><head></head><body><div style=3D"color:#000; background-color:#fff; f=
ont-family:HelveticaNeue-Light, Helvetica Neue Light, Helvetica Neue, Helve=
tica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px"><div><span></span></=
div>Yet.<br> <div id=3D"yui_3_16_0_1_1448121800494_2499" style=3D"font-fam=
ily: HelveticaNeue-Light, Helvetica Neue Light, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, =
Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"> <div id=3D"yui_3_16_0_=
1_1448121800494_2498" style=3D"font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, =
Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"> <div id=3D"=
yui_3_16_0_1_1448121800494_2497" dir=3D"ltr"> <hr size=3D"1"> <font id=3D"y=
ui_3_16_0_1_1448121800494_2500" face=3D"Arial" size=3D"2"> <b><span style=
=3D"font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> "Ray Williams njraywms@optonline.n=
et [colonial-coins]" <colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com><br> <b><span st=
yle=3D"font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> "colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com c=
olonial-coins@yahoogroups.com" <colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com> <br> =
<b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Saturday, November 2=
1, 2015 9:47 AM<br> <b id=3D"yui_3_16_0_1_1448121800494_2502"><span id=3D"y=
ui_3_16_0_1_1448121800494_2501" style=3D"font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span=
></b> Re: [Colonial Numismatics] Scary<br> </font> </div> <div class=3D"y_m=
sg_container"><br><div id=3D"yiv3926936897"><div>
<span style=3D"display: none;"> </span>
<div id=3D"yiv3926936897ygrp-mlmsg">
<div id=3D"yiv3926936897ygrp-msg">
<div id=3D"yiv3926936897ygrp-text">
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
<div>There's something to be said for buying well provenanced coins f=
rom reputable dealers who will make good if there's a problem. I'm gl=
ad I don't collect a modernseries of coins where dependency on third party =
grading is necessary. Not that there aren't colonial fakes - China is=
making them, but in general, they're not deceptive. </div><div>Ray</=
div><div class=3D"qtdSeparateBR"><br><br></div><div class=3D"yiv3926936897y=
qt4603651905" id=3D"yiv3926936897yqt41308"><div style=3D"font-family: Verda=
na;"><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div>On Sat, Nov 21, 201=
5 at 10:32 AM, James Higby earlyamericancoppers@yahoo.com [colonial-coins] =
wrote:<div> </div><div> </div><blockquote style=3D"margin: 0pt 0p=
t 0pt 0.8ex; border-left-color: rgb(136, 136, 136); border-left-width: 2px;=
border-left-style: solid;">
<br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue-Light, Helvet=
ica Neue Light, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif=
; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><div id=3D"yiv392=
6936897yui_3_16_0_1_1448119297364_3204" dir=3D"ltr">Several years ago a dea=
ler friend and I had a discussion of this very phenomenon, which has been g=
oing on for quite some time. And every time there is online disc=
ussion, the slab counterfeiters and coin counterfeiters take heed and corre=
ct their "errors." As they get better and better at their craft,=
there remain fewer and fewer who can tell the difference. Evidence e=
xists that already both major slabbing companies have been fooled. PC=
GS was set up at the Chicago International Coin Fair four years ago wi=
th a display of their own slabs that had fake or altered coins in them.&nbs=
p; This raises the conundrum, "Can a fake coin (or fake slab) be made so we=
ll that no one except the faker can tell the difference?" That
question, of course, has no answer, but the implications are chilling, to =
say the least. <br clear=3D"none"> =
</div><div id=3D"yiv3926936897yui_3_16_0_1_1448119297364_3236" style=3D"fo=
nt-family: HelveticaNeue-Light, Helvetica Neue Light, Helvetica Neue, Helve=
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"> <hr size=3D"1" id=3D"yiv3926936897yui_3_16_0_1_1448119297364_3233"> <fon=
t id=3D"yiv3926936897yui_3_16_0_1_1448119297364_3237" face=3D"Arial" size=
=3D"2"> <b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> "Ray William=
s njraywms@optonline.net [colonial-coins]" <colonial-coins@yahoogroups.c=
om><br clear=3D"none"> <b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">To:</span><=
/b> "colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com colonial-coins@yahoogroups.com" <col=
onial-coins@yahoogroups.com> <br clear=3D"none"> <b><span style=3D"font-=
weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Friday, November 20, 2015 1:36 PM<br clear=
=3D"none"> <b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> [Colon=
ial Numismatics] Scary<br clear=3D"none"> </font> </div> <div class=3D"yiv3=
926936897y_msg_container" id=3D"yiv3926936897yui_3_16_0_1_1448119297364_331=
0"><br clear=3D"none"><div id=3D"yiv3926936897"><div id=3D"yiv3926936897yui=
_3_16_0_1_1448119297364_3312">
<span> </span>
<div id=3D"yiv3926936897ygrp-mlmsg">
<div id=3D"yiv3926936897ygrp-msg">
<div id=3D"yiv3926936897ygrp-text">
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
<div id=3D"yiv3926936897yui_3_16_0_1_1448119297364_3311">Hi Guys,<br =
clear=3D"none">
This is not colonial but it is scary! A coun=
terfeit coin in a <br clear=3D"none">
counterfeit slab! Although not on the below link, I think I heard tha=
t <br clear=3D"none">
the NGC number matches the coin and grade of a real slabbed coin. So =
<br clear=3D"none">
how do we defend ourselves? I don't have the answer. If a coin =
dealer <br clear=3D"none">
is offered something like this, how can they tell it's bad. Most peop=
le <br clear=3D"none">
just assume that if it's in plastic, it's good. <br clear=3D"none">
So if some of my friends out there are investing i=
n slabbed gold or <br clear=3D"none">
silver, be careful. Get receipts, from reputable dealers, that itemiz=
e <br clear=3D"none">
the slab numbers. <br clear=3D"none">
Have fun out there!<br clear=3D"none">
Ray<br clear=3D"none">
</div>
</div>
=20=20=20=20=20
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v>
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</div></blockquote></div></div>
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